Proposal for new forum "Cleaning and Restoration"

[HankB]

We have some great stories about old grill restoration that members have posted. In addition there are questions, answers and a lot of good discussion on the subject of cleaning up and restoring old grills. It seems to me the subject is important enough to warrant it's own forum.

Right now 13 of 20 threads on the first page of "Weber Kettles and Accessories" relate to cleaning and restoration. I think those threads deserve their own area and that will leave "Weber Kettles and Accessories" for other important discussion of equipment.

Perhaps it should be "Cleaning, Restoration and Preservation."

[Duke]

That sounds like a good idea. I think the restorations have outgrown that area.

[Ted B]

I agree. I haven't got a lot of time right now and there is some really fantastic restoration/cleaning projects going on. It would be nice to have an exact spot to go to for help when I get time to clean up what I have in the pipeline.

[G$]

I will be the voice of dissent.

Sometimes a thread morphs in to a resto.  Then what? Or it contains restoration and non restoration topics.  I still think the volume is manageable the way it is.  I sort of like that there are relatively fewer forums, rather than multiple forums with low activity.

Whats next, deleting threads due to inactivity? 

I kid, I kid.

[HankB]

Sometimes a thread morphs in to a resto.  Then what? Or it contains restoration and non restoration topics.  I still think the volume is manageable the way it is.  I sort of like that there are relatively fewer forums, rather than multiple forums with low activity.

Both valid points. I have the same quandary regarding whether to post in "Grilling & BBQing" or "Food Pr0n" I frequently start in "G&B" and then add pictures...

An additional drawback is that there is yet one more forum in which people can post in error resulting in more effort for our mods. I will note that 8 of 20 threads on the first page of "Website Issues & Suggestions" have had to be moved to the proper forum (one of which involves cleaning. )

I do think if that change was made that neither would languish from lack of posts.

[G$]

Good example Hank. I would even vote to combine GB and food pron, to illustrate my point of view.

[1911Ron]

I like the idea of a cleaning and restoration section, not sure about G&B and Food pron tho, i have always thought G&B was for asking questions about grilling and food pron was for the outcome. my 2cents

[Craig]

I like the idea too.

[addicted-to-smoke]

Edit: I just rewrote all this because I'm passionate about it and have used a couple forums for years brave enough to go against the grain and only have ONE or TWO subforums total. It's a little messy and scary at first if you're not used to it but wonderful and organic, like jumping into a stream.

Creating sub forums is popular and tempting thing for any forum. More important than that however is a good search function, because it's all intertwined anyway. Somebody starts a thread about something and it can open up something else, and then which "hole" does the thread really belong in?

Segmenting isn't such a grand idea. It isolates and hides a ton of discussion and/or causes you to spend more time and effort looking for stuff when that's what's software searching for.

I'm NOT a "search nazi" and in fact encourage people to post new threads about old subjects; you get new ideas that way. Keep the stream going, otherwise a forum just becomes a boring, outdated FAQ. My point is that if someone wants to search for something they should be able to find it with a few keywords, not by going into a special room first that's "assumed" to hold everything relevant. It won't because it can't --- that's an honest failure of segmenting with good intentions.I'm all for combining the G&B and Food Pron sub forums. I'd also combine the current "Trading Post" and "Off Topic" into the main kettle section. Think about, it's all related and you already spend a lot of time "flipping channels" when it's not necessary. One main kettle sub forum with a lot of interesting discussion.

When I came here I thought the trading spot was for members buying and selling. Nope, it's where people discuss something they saw. Off -topic isn't about your other interests or political hangups (thankfully) it's where you are discussing some competing grill usually. OK, so it all comes back the Weber kettle anyway! Embrace a little more messy and less segmentation and enjoy a more flavorful place.

And you actually don't need a sub forum just for introductions. I know lots of forums have this. You just really don't need it. Somebody says "hi" and oh by the way here's what I have or can I ask a question about something ... Let all that happen within the main kettle discussion.

You guys are already using most of these sub forums for essentially similar discussion anyway and don't see it yet, because in the end it's all "on topic" and related to why you came here in the first place.

Think it over.

[G$]

Addicted took the time to write what I wanted to say.

[Craig]

That's what makes WKC great! We actually discuss ideas and have intelligent conversation about it. Sometimes we agree, sometimes not, but that's what makes this country great! Different ideas, different perspectives.... This board embodies those qualities! I love the honest feedback. 

[addicted-to-smoke]

OK I don't intend to carpet-bomb WKC with my opinion but I owe you all a solid example, and some proof.

Here's a brief explanation of what you'll see when you visit the site below. Of course, not everything about the structure and topics or people would apply here, so I'm NOT suggesting MRF be cloned into WKC.

MRF forums: http://forums.macresource.com

The political sub forum was created as a sinkhole because people couldn't keep political, divisive comments out of the rest. It's NOT an example of a healthy or sane political forum, despite [some] otherwise decent people there.

The rest:
Apple (the company)
Apple (execs, retail stores et al)
Macs
local Apple software (iTunes, Safari and so on)
online Apple software (iTunes Store, iCloud and previous iterations)
iDevices (iPhones, iPads, iPod touches, iPods)
iDevice apps

And so on. Now break each one of those out into further subforums (It's been done elsewhere. Nice and tidy. And you couldn't find anything.)

You think YOU see segmentation opportunities with a few kettle models here?

There's really only one forum at MRF and it works just fine.

Background: If you visit the site's home page first, http://www.macresource.com you'll see it's one of those computer-related electronics sites that posts sale stuff found around the web including TVs etc., although unlike fatwallet or slickdeals this is mainly an advertising thing owned by a particular vendor, http://www.macsales.com (Other World Computing) even though MOST of what's shown isn't being sold by OWC, so there's not a lot "editorial bias" in that regard.

Now you know why the main forum is called "Tips & Deals" --- it was conceived of a place where users (non OWC staff and non-advertisers) could post about some deal they found online (or ask about one) or where users could ask a (Mac or Apple) computer-related question. But click on it and you'll find few of that, and a shitload of off-topic discussion: http://forums.macresource.com/list/1

Wait --- doesn't that contradict everything I've been saying? Eh, to some extent, but not really. What you're witnessing is a relatively small group of people who became a virtual community by starting with a common interest and learned they have a lot more in common. And critically, without taking away the core attraction, Mac and Apple-related discussion and help. Quite a remarkable balancing act!

Along the way, computers and software got more reliable and so there have been fewer questions about how to buy or fix something. It tends to sorta freak out the newcomers for about a day and then they grok it when they realize they can still find what they need and contribute easily. If they want a forum that needlessly and erroneously pigeonholes their kettle iMac into a subforum there are lots of other BBQ Mac sites that do that. Sometimes aspiring to organization (ironically) gives up usefulness and community.

**************

Coda:
You may be interested to know that model has survived two "deals" sites' forums over 10 years with many of the same core forum members and a few attempts to change it to what everyone else seems to do, have a lot of "useful" "helpful" segmented sub forums.

Dealmac.com began around 1996 or 1997 and used the open-source Phorum forum software (http://www.phorum.org). It imploded in 2006 when admins insisted on segmenting the forum despite related naturally-related crosstalk and using some heavy-handed moderation techniques. The forums survived as vestiges until this spring and then went poof. Odd, don't you think, given that the core topic (Macs and Apple) are stronger than ever. They divided and conquered the users until they had nothing to discuss.

In 2006 MRF was born specifically to look and act like pre-2006 DM forums, complete with the deceptively-simple and insanely elegant Phorum software configured to look and behave how it did on DM's site. I could wax poetic about Phorum, at least how its used at MRF, but that's for another day.

[1buckie]

"erroneously pigeonholes their kettle "


I will give up my erroneously pigeonholed kettle when they pry my cold dead fingers from around it !!!!



But seriously, I wrote Troy a long time ago about a bunch of threads that had, from my perspective at least, had merit or value as to infomation on dating, style changes, colors & the like......there were at that time a few on cleaning & restoration; this area is much more pronounced now.......

He said he'd not like to keep expanding the sections to more & morwe areas & I really get that, 'cause it can turn into
what G$ is talking about.....

I will be the voice of dissent.

Sometimes a thread morphs in to a resto.  Then what? Or it contains restoration and non restoration topics.  I still think the volume is manageable the way it is.  I sort of like that there are relatively fewer forums, rather than multiple forums with low activity.
Whats next, deleting threads due to inactivity? 
I kid, I kid.

Another way  that I was thinking about this, which may or may not make sense to do, or even work worth a dang, is to "Sticky" the posts that develop up into a valueable segment of information....
{ Disclaimer: I'm at best a 2nd or 3rd tier addition to this place, may not be on track at all & probably was allowed in mostly for entertainment purposes anyway.....}

That way, they can be found, they stay put, they develop over time as new info becomes appearent, the info could be more easily distilled for "article-ing" on the front page (stuff that's easy to digest for the general Weber public), but then if anyone wants to see how info was arrived at.....the progession is intact & available......

Here they are:
( And keep in mind, this was dated Nov. 2 right before I got ferociously sick & I gathered up a few more / 5 or 6 / after this AND ALSO ~~~> There's a bunch of newer ones that I've not kept track of.....so this may not work....Yeah, right Buckie let's just "Sticky" the whole place...bumper stickers all around..... )
The one item that doesn't get too well represented is the gas assist Performers, my fault, as I know very little about them & don't know what to look for in a disscussion thread,; I tried.... 

There's also a couple cleaning & repair threads at the bottom, in thinking possibly we could be of service to the general public ( the Weber public, I guess...)

OK ~~~~>>>

http://weberkettleclub.com/forums/weber-kettles-accessories/i-need-your-photos/

Troy's link ^^^^


Vent Code / ramsfan    Oct. 29 2012

http://weberkettleclub.com/forums/weber-kettles-accessories/vent-code/

Morphs into disscusion of ages




Vent Code Dates / G$   7/22/2012

http://weberkettleclub.com/forums/weber-kettles-accessories/vent-code-dates/

Numerous pics, not all complete as of 10/30/2012




Wheel Styles /  Husker-Red ~ Craig   8/10/2012

http://weberkettleclub.com/forums/weber-kettles-accessories/wheel-styles/

Wheels & some extra info, with pics





1977 Kettle - Interesting / Troy  7/11/2012

http://weberkettleclub.com/forums/weber-kettles-accessories/1977-kettle-interesting/

  Various Changes Disscussed





The Estate  (Chesnut-Copperton)  / Zavod 44- Brian  9/1/2012

http://weberkettleclub.com/forums/weber-kettles-accessories/the-estate-(chestnut-copperton)/

Various colors & years, fairly extensive disscussion





My Seville / Thoraudio  9/5/2012

http://weberkettleclub.com/forums/weber-kettles-accessories/my-seville/

Different styles, comments




Mastertouch Production Years / G  9/3/2012

http://weberkettleclub.com/forums/weber-kettles-accessories/mastertouch-production-years/

Production Years,  some info




Red Ranger / oompappy  8/24/2012

http://weberkettleclub.com/forums/weber-kettles-accessories/red-ranger/

Years, differences




Project: Warrior /  Husker-Red ~ Craig   9/19/2012

http://weberkettleclub.com/forums/weber-kettles-accessories/project-warrior/

Cleaning & Fixing Info & some dates





"The Duke"  Premium One Touch weber Project  6/22/2012

http://weberkettleclub.com/forums/weber-kettles-accessories/'the-duke'-one-touch-premium-weber-project/

Suggests the questions of  Mastertouch, lid bales, therms, overseas models...
Not disscussed, but the timeline of various "new models" may need to be addressed


 


Metal Handle Date Question / Eastex  9/16/2012

http://weberkettleclub.com/forums/weber-kettles-accessories/metal-handle-date-question/

Metal Handle years, also disscusses theivery & purchases





Super Awesome Vintage Weber Ketlle / Troy  7/30/2012

http://weberkettleclub.com/forums/weber-kettles-accessories/super-awesome-vintage-weber-kettle/

Long Disscussion, pics, catalog pics, real oldies





Old 26" Found..... / Jeff  8/27/2012

http://weberkettleclub.com/forums/weber-kettles-accessories/old-26-found/

Disscussion & spec on older models, not just 26"





Holy Grail Kettles  /  1911Ron  8/3/2012

http://weberkettleclub.com/forums/weber-kettles-accessories/holy-grail-kettles/

Unique & Odd colors & items brought up





How Cool Would it be to Find some of These Accessories for the 26'r ?  /  Duke  9/18/2012

http://weberkettleclub.com/forums/weber-kettles-accessories/how-cool-would-it-be-to-find-some-of-these-accessories-for-the-26'r/

Catalog & dates








For Cleaning & Repair~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Riveted Handle Removal  /  Husker-Red ~ Craig   10/4/2012

http://weberkettleclub.com/forums/weber-kettles-accessories/riveted-handle-removal/

Handle styles & repair



Ranch Resto Update / Questions  /  G   9/24/2012

http://weberkettleclub.com/forums/weber-kettles-accessories/ranch-resto-updatequestions/

Paint, cleaning, age, rust




Don't Throw Away That Old Weber !  /  Larry Wolfe  8/20/2012

http://weberkettleclub.com/forums/weber-kettles-accessories/don't-throw-away-that-old-weber!/

Sweeper remover & styles


~~~~> Ken (1buckie)




 
"You can't be a real country unless you have a beer and an airline - it helps if you have some kind of a football team, or some nuclear weapons, but at the very least you need a beer".
--Frank Zappa

[addicted-to-smoke]

I do like the idea of a FAQ for kettle differences and parts resources, some of which has already been started or discussed. But on a forum you need an editor for that to funnel info into. And then you need an editorial "brake" (or break!) mechanism for it, if it becomes stale or irrelevant. Another option could be user-generated info added to a wiki but that may be overkill, I don't know.

[pbe gummi bear]

What about a sticky with the WKC best of threads? Once a thread becomes a reference, a moderator can copy it to the list. The sticky topic should also be closed so that the discussions form organically in the main forum. We will always have new members coming in who will not know where this awesome info is.

I can already think of a bunch of threads for this list.