Weber Kettle Club Forums

Okay you sickos (you know who you are), that's not what I mean by happy ending.

So a few months back, just before the 4th of July, I ordered a white MasterTouch from Canada. Unfortunately I didn't get it until after the 4th, so I couldn't do my red, white and blue pic.

Fast forward a couple of months and I decide to order a couple of Zav handles for it. When they arrived a few weeks ago, I went to install them and this is what I see when I uncover the grill.  Mind you,  I haven't even used it yet.

(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160913/6e12d0c0c40e662cf50faaee866775a5.jpg)

(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160913/436969e4a2b50f6a61482f59cd5618c0.jpg)

Oh the horror!

I've put on the taco handles before, so I am well aware you need to be careful not to over-tighten them.  So I was pissed.  I called up Weber and explained to them.  It took a while to get them to understand that this was a white and that I needed a white replacement. I sent them some pics and they put in an order for a replacement lid. A few days later, no confirmation so I called.  To make a long story short,  it was multiple calls and two weeks before it finally shipped.  So here's the happy ending part.

(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160913/a2b18d989f92533417632dca2411d793.jpg)
(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160913/54a39cc7bcab613a54de13cf8499c767.jpg)
(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160913/7c58d187e1031d467bc44a6be03576c1.jpg)

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Wow that's a beauty for sure.

So how about the red, white and blue pic?

Quote from: tspin818 on September 13, 2016, 09:40:38 AM
So how about the red, white and blue pic?

Hoping to get to it this weekend.  Wanted to do it for labor day, but the lid just showed up today.  Only had enough time during my lunch break to get the new handles on and snap the few pics I posted.

Quote from: mcgolden on September 13, 2016, 09:42:24 AM

Quote from: tspin818 on September 13, 2016, 09:40:38 AM
So how about the red, white and blue pic?

Hoping to get to it this weekend.  Wanted to do it for labor day, but the lid just showed up today.  Only had enough time during my lunch break to get the new handles on and snap the few pics I posted.

Cool, looking forward to it!

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Are those Zav handles the bird's eye maple?
Those look great.
Oh ya... that kettle is pretty sick too. ;)

Quote from: Kneab on September 13, 2016, 10:10:27 AM
Are those Zav handles the bird's eye maple?
Those look great.
Oh ya... that kettle is pretty sick too. ;)

Yup, bird's eye maple.  I saw some that he had done for some others and I thought it would be a good fit for this light colored kettle.  As always, he did a great job.

The same happened to my new ivory aswell,except where the hanger for the lid holder went through the bowl. Called weber Tuesday after the holiday and and received a new bowl and lid Friday, and still have the organ al lid and bowl.

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Glad everything turned out for you, your kettle looks amazing! !!

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Quote from: RottiGuy on September 13, 2016, 10:19:52 AM
The same happened to my new ivory aswell,except where the hanger for the lid holder went through the bowl. Called weber Tuesday after the holiday and and received a new bowl and lid Friday, and still have the organ al lid and bowl.

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Wow, I wish they had sent me a new bowl too.  I just hope that the new lid and existing bowl hold up over time.

Well I'm using the origanal, and have the new lid and bowl in the garage boxed up.

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Glad they got it all worked out. Man, I bet you felt a little sick when you pulled that cover off. All good now. Looks clean brother.


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Those handles are very nice!!!

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Quote from: mcgolden on September 13, 2016, 10:23:52 AM

Quote from: RottiGuy on September 13, 2016, 10:19:52 AM
The same happened to my new ivory aswell,except where the hanger for the lid holder went through the bowl. Called weber Tuesday after the holiday and and received a new bowl and lid Friday, and still have the organ al lid and bowl.

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Wow, I wish they had sent me a new bowl too.  I just hope that the new lid and existing bowl hold up over time.

I've seen this posted frequently here regarding the taco handle installation. Kind of concerning that just a little to much torque and the porcelain cracks. I wonder what these beauties will look like in 10 years. Is it just a case of standard corporate cost cutting? A thinner layer of enamel?


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Quote from: mcgolden on September 13, 2016, 10:23:52 AM
I just hope that the new lid and existing bowl hold up over time.

You can do that....just don't put any money on the hope.

I suspect is not just over-tightening that is causing the chips but normal use. Simply picking the lid up  and putting it in the bail holder is causing stress, slight movement and chips where junction points are located.

It appears to me that when these types of issues are posted, they are almost always on colored kettles.

Is it an illusion, or does the black somehow bond/hold up better?  I put my WSMs through every abuse you can imagine and never had a finish issue, even on the 15+ year old one I bought used.  My OTS isn't exactly babied and isn't showing to be any worse for wear either.

I'm glad everything worked out for you. It's always better with a happy ending.

Well I'm just going to say it !

This version of the MT is cheesy. I use my ivory for catering and I have to tighten the handle all the time despite upgrading to SS hardware . The legs are super thin walled and the slightest impact to the side of one would likely buckle the leg and dump the kettle. The porcelain is ok , mine had black specks in places that you can feel and installing the push button legs cost me porcelain as well. It does cook as good as any Weber and it's beautiful to look at but for the price I was underwhelmed with the quality  and that's why I put mine in the catering lineup. It's clean to look at and I won't be heartbroken if it gets dinged.


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I will *NOT* cook on this kettle. I will just put it in a corner and admire it day in and day out and cook on my Home Depot bought 22.5" Black OTG. What a beauty!

Quote from: fljoemon on September 13, 2016, 01:41:37 PM
I will *NOT* cook on this kettle. I will just put it in a corner and admire it day in and day out and cook on my Home Depot bought 22.5" Black OTG. What a beauty!

I'm considering doing the same

I had the same thing happen to me with my green MT.  With a new replacement lid, I had no issues so far.  I use  charcoal holder or coals to the side without touching the inside bowl. No issues so far.  You can cook on it fine no problem.

With special color kettles like these, it is a small price to pay to have few odd chips happen.  One thing for sure, Weber would gladly send you a replacement at your request anyways. So it is all good.   

Quote from: Idahawk on September 13, 2016, 01:19:04 PM
Well I'm just going to say it !

This version of the MT is cheesy. I use my ivory for catering and I have to tighten the handle all the time despite upgrading to SS hardware . The legs are super thin walled and the slightest impact to the side of one would likely buckle the leg and dump the kettle. The porcelain is ok , mine had black specks in places that you can feel and installing the push button legs cost me porcelain as well. It does cook as good as any Weber and it's beautiful to look at but for the price I was underwhelmed with the quality  and that's why I put mine in the catering lineup. It's clean to look at and I won't be heartbroken if it gets dinged.


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As for other parts like legs and triangle, all new kettles are thinner than older 70's kettle parts.  Quality wise, all modern kettles are the same.  MT do have longer legs so maybe with good impact they are more prone to buckling.  I don't use mine the way you do, so I don't know under extreme conditions.  I have moved mine around few times and have never felt it wasn't stable and sturdy.  As for nut backing out on the handle, drop of loctite on the bolt thread will stop it from backing out. Better than lock washer I mentioned previously.

I think with price cheaper than reg. black Master touch (in Canada anyways), IMO, Special Edition MT represents tremendous value.  Who knows, it may one day become a collectors item. :)

@ mcgolden- It looks beautiful with those handles.  You do what you want,but don't be afraid to cook on it.  Besides, few heat cycles by cooking on it and checking for other porcelain popping issue will be good idea anyways.  You will get more satisfaction out of cooking and food will taste better on this than cooking on Reg. OTG.  At least, I think so.  :) :) :)

Well, I've been using my copper performer on a regular basis over the past 5 months and have not have issues with porcelain chipping. When I put it together, I used the plastic tool that Weber supplied. I only tightened enough so that the handle felt snug with no wobble. Now, I wonder if using their tool prevents over tightening compared to using a socket or a wrench.

Then again, there may be enamel issues as well or even hardware issues with washers & stuff due to the manufacturing process.

There are so many variables, but in the end, it's good to see Weber step up and make it right.

I also had issues with the porcelain cracking when installing the taco style handle on a coloured kettle lid. Effing annoying!

Since then I have  installed a heat resistant fibre washer between the handle and lid, & also did the same on the inside of the lid on my other kettles.
It allows you to snug up the nut that wee bit more, to prevent handle-wobble and porcelain cracking.

I hate those stupid plastic wrenches that are supplied to assemble the grill. I've scraped a knuckle of two using them. I understand they are supposed to round off so you don't over-tighten the nut. But still....they're shit!

Quote from: TonyUK on September 14, 2016, 01:44:44 AM
I also had issues with the porcelain cracking when installing the taco style handle on a coloured kettle lid. Effing annoying!

Since then I have  installed a heat resistant fibre washer between the handle and lid, & also did the same on the inside of the lid on my other kettles.
It allows you to snug up the nut that wee bit more, to prevent handle-wobble and porcelain cracking.

I hate those stupid plastic wrenches that are supplied to assemble to grill. I've scraped a knuckle of two using them. I understand they are supposed to round off so you don't over-tighten the nut. But still.

Where did you get the heat resistant washers?

mcg.

They are widely available online. Google Heat Resistant Fibre Washers.

or

You can get exhaust manifold gasket material for motorcycles and cut out your own.

I often wonder if corporate folks from weber monitor this forum for potential issues and successes with Thier product and make notes...

Jeff

Quote from: jeffrackmo on September 14, 2016, 05:08:29 AM
I often wonder if corporate folks from weber monitor this forum for potential issues and successes with Thier product and make notes...

Jeff

I think if this club existed several years ago then sure. When it was all made here in the USA. Now I think they are too concerned with cheaper manufacturing. My opinion based on what I've read about the newer kettles.


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Quote from: kettlebb on September 14, 2016, 05:47:36 AM

Quote from: jeffrackmo on September 14, 2016, 05:08:29 AM
I often wonder if corporate folks from weber monitor this forum for potential issues and successes with Thier product and make notes...

I think if this club existed several years ago then sure. When it was all made here in the USA. Now I think they are too concerned with cheaper manufacturing. My opinion based on what I've read about the newer kettles.

Quote #1: You can pretty much take that to the bank!

Quote #2: Still among the best value products from an American company - bar none. Concerned about cheaper manufacturing? Sure - who isn't! Newer kettles? Like the Master Touch perhaps? Have you seen the Summit? Some of the best Weber products ever. My opinion based on what I cook on. 

Very true @56MPG. Please don't misunderstand. I'm not bashing Weber. I still think they are the best damn grills on the market. Hands down beats anything else out there. I just think like most things these days, they don't make them like they used to. I got an A code recently and it just feels like a more solid kettle than the new ones in the store.


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 You guys scared the hell  out of me, so I went to check on my Ivory.
All good, still unmarked.

I hear you too. The incremental changes (cost reductions or regulatory restrictions) are minimal year-by-year, but over time add up. Comparing anything from 1979 (or 1989) to something similar today will often point that out. Americans have to be willing to pay more for something better, (let alone America made) but that's not often the way it works. As a product designer for many years (power tools mainly) I felt first hand the sting of yearly cost reduction targets and material changes. Mot often it's the retailer driving that, not the company making the widget. It's a balancing act to preserve quality and performance in the face of unrelenting competition. Blame the big-boxes if you have to blame someone. I guarantee every engineer at Weber would love to build a grill the way it should be built. Stainless legs? Sure! Heavier gauge steel? Absolutely! Wood handles? They would have to hire Brian!

All we can do is keep the flame alive by celebrating the best of what they did in the past, and supporting the best of what they do today.

Marty

Quote from: 56MPG on September 14, 2016, 08:27:18 AM
I hear you too. The incremental changes (cost reductions or regulatory restrictions) are minimal year-by-year, but over time add up. Comparing anything from 1979 (or 1989) to something similar today will often point that out. Americans have to be willing to pay more for something better, (let alone America made) but that's not often the way it works. As a product designer for many years (power tools mainly) I felt first hand the sting of yearly cost reduction targets and material changes. Mot often it's the retailer driving that, not the company making the widget. It's a balancing act to preserve quality and performance in the face of unrelenting competition. Blame the big-boxes if you have to blame someone. I guarantee every engineer at Weber would love to build a grill the way it should be built. Stainless legs? Sure! Heavier gauge steel? Absolutely! Wood handles? They would have to hire Brian!

All we can do is keep the flame alive by celebrating the best of what they did in the past, and supporting the best of what they do today.

Marty

Amen Marty!


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Quote from: 56MPG on September 14, 2016, 08:27:18 AM
I hear you too. The incremental changes (cost reductions or regulatory restrictions) are minimal year-by-year, but over time add up. Comparing anything from 1979 (or 1989) to something similar today will often point that out. Americans have to be willing to pay more for something better, (let alone America made) but that's not often the way it works. As a product designer for many years (power tools mainly) I felt first hand the sting of yearly cost reduction targets and material changes. Mot often it's the retailer driving that, not the company making the widget. It's a balancing act to preserve quality and performance in the face of unrelenting competition. Blame the big-boxes if you have to blame someone. I guarantee every engineer at Weber would love to build a grill the way it should be built. Stainless legs? Sure! Heavier gauge steel? Absolutely! Wood handles? They would have to hire Brian!

All we can do is keep the flame alive by celebrating the best of what they did in the past, and supporting the best of what they do today.

Marty

Well said brother


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Amen X2! I have to agree 56MPH. The big box stores are begging quality mfgs. for their products in their stores but keep complaining that ''are customers can't afford them''. They keep pestering them for a cheap (made in china) product with there name on it. Some mfgs. have refused for years but (sadly) finally gave in.
You know I noticed the walmart is selling cheap (made in china) snapper lawn mowers and weber 22'' JJ grills now.
https://www.fastcompany.com/54763/man-who-said-no-wal-mart (https://www.fastcompany.com/54763/man-who-said-no-wal-mart)


http://weberkettleclub.com/forums/weber-kettles-accessories/?action=post2

  I was a Traeger dealer around the time they cheapened up their products and moved overseas and it caused me so many customer service nightmares that I dropped my dealership. As word of Traeger's shortcomings spread through the BBQ community I'm sure it cost them dearly and that's why their now hocking a unit on an infomercial !  People that know won't touch them with a ten foot pole while Memphis and Yodor are building kick ass solid  units for just slightly more then a high end Traeger . Traeger effectively sold their soul to devil for the bottom line but lost all their respect in the BBQ community and that's who most people look for when they need advise. Maybe Weber is going down the same path and simply wants to move units, as many units as they can in the box stores and they don't care if Joe blow has a quality product or not. It's about quantity not quality . I don't fault a company for making money but not at the cost of integrity.

Here were are talking about adding parts to a new Weber just so it's functional ? Just like guys are buying non Traeger brains to run those ? I'd be embarrassed as a company if it were mine. George welded those handles on for a reason , he wanted you to feel a solid lid in your hand , giving you the peace of mind that you've made the right choice in a grill  not some wiggly piece of metal that comes with a wrench !




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Quote from: kettlebb on September 14, 2016, 08:09:22 AM
Very true @56MPG. Please don't misunderstand. I'm not bashing Weber. I still think they are the best damn grills on the market. Hands down beats anything else out there. I just think like most things these days, they don't make them like they used to. I got an A code recently and it just feels like a more solid kettle than the new ones in the store.


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That's a crock of shit.

I work for the company that makes the steel for Weber kettles. You would be amazed at how we have to inspect this stuff. Trust me the steel is good.

Thanks for the correction @Darko


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Quote from: Darko on September 14, 2016, 05:41:12 PM

Quote from: kettlebb on September 14, 2016, 08:09:22 AM
Very true @56MPG. Please don't misunderstand. I'm not bashing Weber. I still think they are the best damn grills on the market. Hands down beats anything else out there. I just think like most things these days, they don't make them like they used to. I got an A code recently and it just feels like a more solid kettle than the new ones in the store.


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That's a crock of shit.

I work for the company that makes the steel for Weber kettles. You would be amazed at how we have to inspect this stuff. Trust me the steel is good.

Not a crock of shit at all. My older ones are slightly heavier. Plus the orange peel effect is not present in newer Kettles. To top it off I cannot buy a non taco handle so old will always be better. MBH's make better food.

Remember, your kettle is made from the finest Canadian steel. I Guarantee it.

Quote from: MrHoss on September 14, 2016, 06:15:05 PM

Quote from: Darko on September 14, 2016, 05:41:12 PM

Quote from: kettlebb on September 14, 2016, 08:09:22 AM
Very true @56MPG. Please don't misunderstand. I'm not bashing Weber. I still think they are the best damn grills on the market. Hands down beats anything else out there. I just think like most things these days, they don't make them like they used to. I got an A code recently and it just feels like a more solid kettle than the new ones in the store.


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That's a crock of shit.

I work for the company that makes the steel for Weber kettles. You would be amazed at how we have to inspect this stuff. Trust me the steel is good.

Not a crock of shit at all. My older ones are slightly heavier. Plus the orange peel effect is not present in newer Kettles. To top it off I cannot buy a non taco handle so old will always be better. MBH's make better food.

Guess what! Steel has changed over the years. We make steel now that is thinner and stronger than what was made before.

As for orange peel, I got nothing to do with that

As for non taco, you can always buy the fireplace handles.

yeah I agree that old is always cooler, not necessarily better. But then again steaks taste better off my Seville than they do off my copper Performer.

I think the old ones are heavier Darko.....I was not kidding! And as such cook better for low and slow applications. I don't want to add handles. The newer ones may be made of your Hamilton steel but I don't like the way they fit! As far as grilling I like a one touch with the bucket. Steaks taste the same to me.

I'll do a weigh off. We'll see if there is much difference.

 :o How do I get me one of those?! Congrats!

Quote from: Darko on September 14, 2016, 07:30:03 PM
I'll do a weigh off. We'll see if there is much difference.

There's your answer right there.  Look forward to the results!

Quote from: Darko on September 14, 2016, 07:30:03 PM
I'll do a weigh off. We'll see if there is much difference.

I also look forward to the results. I agree that the older lids feel much heavier than the newer lids. I have picked up one in each hand and there is a definite difference. It will be interesting to see the actual difference. The exception is 26" lids which are the opposite for weight difference.  The newer lids are much heavier than the old flat tops. @argentflame , @Heyjude and I were discussing this last weekend.  I guess they had to use a heavier gauge of steel due to the different shape of the newer lid.  The flat top lids feel much lighter. 

Here you go;

DA code 2630 grams  5.79 lbs
AA code  2550 grams 5.62 lbs
New performer 2620 grams 5.77 lbs
Seville  2850 grams 6.28 lbs

These are the lid weights.

For reference

DA=2001
AA=2011


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Quote from: Darko on September 15, 2016, 07:32:06 AM
Here you go;

DA code 2630 grams  5.79 lbs
AA code  2550 grams 5.62 lbs
New performer 2620 grams 5.77 lbs
Seville  2850 grams 6.28 lbs

These are the lid weights.

Just curious. With these results, what percentage heavier is the old Seville lid than the new performer lid? Got to be some engineers or math wizards here. I certainly am not. I have to find a method to weigh and compare my 26" lids.

Not an engineer, but I believe 8% heavier.

I should have said this, the DA lid and the new performer lid have Brian's handles and tabs on them. The AA has the plastic handle on it and the Seville has the original wood handle. It's probably no more than an ounce difference but it should be stated.

That's beautiful,  Where did you order yours from? 

Ordered what?

I was farting around with 93 and 96 performer lids and while they felt about the same weight-wise, their shape was different enough to see relatively easily. (I searched here, found this old thread, and figured it was near-topic enough).

Acknowledging the reflection difference, it seems like the lid on the left has a higher rise and a wider rim lip. Or is it just my imagination running away with me?

(http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l255/vigbert/20170612_182013_zpsofcyq2qi.jpg) (http://s98.photobucket.com/user/vigbert/media/20170612_182013_zpsofcyq2qi.jpg.html)

(http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l255/vigbert/20170612_182044_zpssmmnhnw7.jpg) (http://s98.photobucket.com/user/vigbert/media/20170612_182044_zpssmmnhnw7.jpg.html)

The older one might have been spun, rather than stamped.

Thanks