Dear Folks,
I'm new here, and was hoping for some help.
I have an old (15 years) Weber Performer Charcoal grill - the kind with the gas ignition start.
It's the only grill I've ever owed, and I absolutely love it.
The problem is that the 5lb tank I have is too old to be refilled.
Further, if I understand correctly, the style of the tank is no longer being manufactured (it has a connection to the regulator that slips on and off). This necessitates some adjustments on my end to keep the grill in use.
To be honest, I've always had some difficultly getting the five pound tank refilled, as the propane places near me don't seem too pleased with wasting their time refilling it for me. So, I figured I'd take this opportunity to replace my 5 pound tank with those 1 pound disposable propane tanks.
From my local hardware store, I picked up two adapters that, when attached to the grill's regulator, permit me to screw the 1 pound propane tank right in.
HOWEVER, no gas is coming through whatsoever when I do that.
Would anyone happen to have any ideas or suggestions on how I should go about addressing this situation?
My best guess is that the grill's original regulator is not compatible with the 1lb tanks - or otherwise needs to be adjusted as a result of this change. But I could be completely wrong about that.
Any help whatsoever would be much appreciated. Thank you.
I am no expert with the 5 lb tanks but i have seen posts from others that are:
1. the tanks are not common anymore but the they can be found online.
2. you may be able to have your tank updated by changing the hardware to add an OPD (overfill protection device) that is now required by law.
3. if your adapters aren't working i would check the regulator, hoses, and burners for clogs. When was the last time the gas assist worked? Over time they can get clogged by debris, dirt, ash, and even spider webs. I would dissemble and check for clogs first as that seems like the first thing to rule out.
Thanks Charlie. The gas assist has worked just fine up until a week or so ago when the tank went empty (I haven't refilled it in a couple of years and am 90% certain that's what happened).
I could buy a whole new assembly, made for the 1 lb propone tanks, but was hoping I could make due with my existing assembly provided I get my hands on the proper adapters. Everything fits together, but the gas won't flow. I'm wondering if it's a problem with the settings on the regulator.
If it was just working, i would double check the connections on the new adapter then. make sure everything is tight. Perhaps the regulator (part 41 or 42 below) needs to be adjusted? Maybe the pressure output is different on the 1lb vs the 5 lb'ers. More research would be required on this subject.
(http://www.ereplacementparts.com/images/weber/821020_WW_1.gif)
Thanks. I'm going to fiddle with the regulator.
I'd suggest getting your 5lb tank recertified. About $25 and it's good for 10 more years, no hassle at the station.
the new 5lb tanks don't work with the old connections - I need a new connection in any event (or an adapter)
Quote from: Rjames on June 11, 2015, 10:01:01 AM
the new 5lb tanks don't work with the old connections - I need a new connection in any event (or an adapter)
So the tank is empty. Needs to be re-certified. And the quick connect is busted? All three? If everything was just working fine it sounds like you might just need your existing tank re-certified and refilled. Which, as 604 mentions, isn't a huge deal, and a much easier solution.
Rjames, just get an "Acme" adapter, should look like this: http://www.amazon.com/Mr-Heater-F276495-Propane-Fitting/dp/B000BQT5H2 it replaces the existing fitting coming off your regulator.
Should screw on by hand to a modern tank or older tank that's been fitted with modern OPD valve. Call around about your tank; this isn't worth hassling with converting to 1lb tanks. My local ACE does it; they ring it up as a "4lb" tank, don't ask my why.
Just don't let anyone ring it up as a "BBQ tank" or they'll charge you the 20lb refill price.
I couldn't get the tank recertified.
A replacement with the quick-connect seems to cost at least $80.
I'd rather simply switch to the disposable 1lb propane canisters.
I'm wondering if that's possible.
The adapters I purchased all fit, and everything screws together / connects nicely. Yet the gas won't flow.
Thanks addicted. That's the adapter I purchased. One end screws directly onto the regulator.
On the other end, I've attached another adapter that allows me to screw the 1lb canisters.
Just don't know why it's not working - everything looks correct.
There is usually a second smaller brass "on/off" valve near the regulator as well - is that open too?
Yes - a small little lever that rotates 90-degrees on/off. I've checked that. Thank you.
Has anyone ever successfully tried this - that is, converting their system from the 5lb tank to the 1lb canisters? I don't see why it shouldn't work.
Home depo and lows both sell the little 5lb propane tanks they are just a little spendy they are like 50-60$ and if you notice on the regulator the quick conect fitting is screwed into the regulator it will thread out and you can buy the correct pice to screw into a standard 5lb or 20lb tank from your local propane distributor or most welding shops Cary them or buy online chances are your old tank wiill need the valve replaced with an overfill protection handle anyway as well as recertified
Rjames I don't know if anyone on this forum has converted to 1lb tanks on the SS Performer. As to your problem, it could be that the pressures are indeed different and that a different regulator is needed.
I don't know your location, you haven't added it to your avatar profile, but a $65 Manchester tank (they have the proper size/shape/mount design) from Amazon or ACE hardware delivered to your door might just be the best long term solution, especially if you use the grill often.
Thank you to everyone for your help on this. I very much appreciate it.
Quote from: addicted-to-smoke on June 11, 2015, 01:57:55 PM
Rjames I don't know if anyone on this forum has converted to 1lb tanks on the SS Performer. As to your problem, it could be that the pressures are indeed different and that a different regulator is needed.
I don't know your location, you haven't added it to your avatar profile, but a $65 Manchester tank (they have the proper size/shape/mount design) from Amazon or ACE hardware delivered to your door might just be the best long term solution, especially if you use the grill often.
People have put the new style regulator and hose for the 1lb tanks on performers in the past. Check this thread: http://weberkettleclub.com/forums/weber-kettles-accessories/gas-assist-added-to-mesa-azul/
Conceptually, this is very easy. Both Gas assists use the same burner tube. You would just need to purchase this burner assembly for $32: http://www.ereplacementparts.com/regulator-assembly-p-1477523.html
(http://www.ereplacementparts.com/images/part_p_1477523_2290167233.gif)
then figure out how to mount it and access the knob. The 2 bolts mount are bottom mounted to the regulator so you will likely need some king of L-Bracket or secure the bottle itself.
Its up to you if you want to pursue this route. I personally converted my SS to an 11lb tank with the latest gen SS regulator. It's about the same price as a 5lb tank and lasts a longggg time for gas assist use.
(http://i1065.photobucket.com/albums/u391/pbegummibear/Facebook/NoSubject/EEBF0953-7210-42E2-8909-2EE0A99A214E_zpshck97ods.jpg)
Quote from: pbe gummi bear on May 18, 2013, 09:37:46 PM
I realized I should probably share my rationale why I went this route with the regulator.
I basically had 4 options
1. Get the old 5# tank recertified
2. Buy the new style performer regulator assembly
3. Buy the old style assembly with the OPD/QCC1 adapter.
4. The Gummi Bear option- new tank with normal modern valve, but adapt the existing regulator.
Option 2:
(http://www.ereplacementparts.com/images/part_p_1477523_702566114_med.gif)
available here: http://www.ereplacementparts.com/regulator-assembly-p-1477523.html
Option 3:
(http://www.ereplacementparts.com/images/part_p_1477479_2534160992_med.gif)
available here: http://www.ereplacementparts.com/hose-and-regulator-assembly-p-1477479.html
I decided against 1 because at the end of the day I would still have an old tank that is difficult to fill and would be specific to my performer. I called around a few places to see if they would fill an RV quick connect but I soon realized I didn't want to go through the hassle. I decided against #2 because it would cost me about 40 dollars in parts and I don't like discarding parts that still work- ie. my existing line and regulator. I would have also had to make a custom bracket for the valve that is oriented 90deg from the tank, and disposable tanks aren't economic and environmentally friendly. #3 is an attractive option but I didn't realize until very recently that they introduced this at the end of the ss life cycle. Even if I went this route, I would need a new valve on my tank.
I like the 11# tank because it can be filled at any station, portable enough to take on trips, and fit underneath the table cleanly. Aesthetics were very important to me and a 20# tank would have stuck way too much.
Quote from: pbe gummi bear on May 20, 2013, 08:30:14 AM
Gas regulator update
I've decided that I was going to give up the Gummi Bear option #4 and try to adapt this regulator to the new tank. Thanks, HeyJude and 1Buckie for looking out for me. I've seen some ghetto rigged propane setups from asian food carts but I'd rather be safe than sorry. I am going to order the complete regulator setup with the QCC1 connector Option #3 above for the following reasons:
-Current QCC1 connections are 1/4" NPT standard, not 5/16" like the input end of the regulator. There is barely any support for this size anymore, and I have been searching. EDIT: people have been able to pull the QCC1 connections from gassers and use them with no problem. YMMV.
-Barb fittings are not reccomended for propane (Thanks, AJ!). After doing so research the propane pressure is pretty high: http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/propane-vapor-pressure-d_1020.html Note the Logarithmic scale on the y-axis pressure . Propane fittings and hoses are treated as high pressure fittings that should be threaded and sealed, or machine crimped. They are similar to hydraulic lines.
-Option 3 is plug and play and easy. It will also replace the 15 year old hose and regulator which is probably a good thing!
I just thought of somthing that may be causing the gas to not flow with your set up gas regulators usually have a safety lock out in built into them. if the lever to let gas flow is open when you screw the bottle onto the regulator the rush of gas coming in closes it down. what you might try is unscrew the bottle to relive the pressure then close the small gas lever then screw the bottle back on and try slowly opening the small lever and see if you get gas flowing it resets the regulator. It's a safety thing to keep someone from hooking up a bottle with a gas valve already open on an appliance and a bunch of gas coming out and blowing up
tremendously helpful everyone - thanks.
I've put these two adapters together:
http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41c5EBioqPL._SY355_.jpg
http://cdn3.volusion.com/dxylq.nruds/v/vspfiles/photos/14-9715-2T.jpg?1368516713
I did some fiddling, and can't get anything to come out of the propane tank with these - even when they're not connected to the BBQ. Perhaps these adapters don't work with one another.
If you swap the connector back does your old tank work?
I'm sure there's folks here that paid more attention in physics and chemistry class than me but here's my understanding.
The pressure inside a 1lb and a 20 pound propane tank will be the same regardless of tank size. The pressure of the vaporized propane gas inside the tank can only fluctuate (from 10 pounds per square inch to over 250 pounds per square inch) depending on the air temperature the tank is sitting in. A BBQ typically only needs about 6 OUNCES per square inch of pressure. The low pressure regulators job is to adjust the tank pressure down to the level needed by the BBQ and account for any fluctuations in tank pressure and lp needed by the BBQ
Blah, blah blah...still awake?
Ok so assuming the pressure regulator, hose, and hole in the brass orifice that goes into the burner tube are functioning correctly, and the 1 lb tank is upright when you are using it, and you didn't turn the tank on full with the valve open causing the regulator to shut down the flow completely, I think you're on the right track thinking it's the new fittings.
Just to complicate matters my daughter hooked up a 20 to her performer with a conn for a Q tank conversion no problems
do you have a 20# tank to try ? Just wondering
Quote from: Rjames on June 11, 2015, 02:05:51 PM
Thank you to everyone for your help on this. I very much appreciate it.
These kinds of threads are very helpful in troubleshooting .....not only here, but also in the future.....you're already paying it forward !!!!
Thank You !!!!!
In response to a question, I only have an old, quick-release 5lb tank that ran out of gas a couple of weeks ago. That's what kicked this whole quest off. But it had been working fine.
Contrary to my initially thinking, I don't think the issue is the regulator. These adapters are supposed to allow folks to swap out their 20 lb tanks for a 1lb if the need arises - without having to change or adjust the regulator. I think the problem has to do with these two adapters.
With those two adapters connected to the 1lb propane canister, shouldn't gas start flowing out? Shouldn't I at least hear or smell something? The screw-on "steak saver" adapter, by itself, doesn't cause the gas to flow. I think this is ok. Indeed, some folks seem to store the canisters with these adapters on them (not recommended by the way). My understanding is that when, with this adapter in place, the canister is connected to the next piece of hardware - the adapter that connects to the regulator - then the gas should start flowing. But this isn't happening. Keeping the regulator out of the picture, I simply can't get gas out of the canister with these two adapters.
I'm going to take the two adapters and the canister to my local hardware store and ask them to take a look at things. Maybe I'm connecting them wrong somehow. Or maybe the canister is defective or something. I'll let everyone know what I find out.
The adapters for the 1#er have a bypass valve in them, similar to the ones 5+# cylinder OPD valves have in them, since the OPD was mandated. It slows and /or stops the flow in the event of an excessive or sudden flow and also acts as a check valve or back-flow eliminator if it needs to. Connecting it to an appliance and turning it on slowly should allow the pressure to equalize after a minute, then it should work correctly.
Your 5# cylinder can be easily refilled despite the test date. Nobody ever checks it before they fill'em up. If you want to check your 5#er to see if theres gas in it you can either slosh it around to feel the liquid moving, weigh it, using the tare weight of the cylinder located on the valve guard/neck ring (should be stamped T.W.9.8# W.C.13#, T.W.= tare weight & W.C.= water capacity (lbs)) OR you COULD use a screw driver to open the OPD to see if any pressure escapes(it only takes about 6oz pressure to make a low pressure regulator regulate, any less is non-regulated). If the tank is empty it wont hiss if it does it wont be much or for long.
My recommendation is to reuse the cylinder the grill came with, especially if it lasts for two years between fill-ups. The amount of monkey motion wasted on the 1#er has already exceeded the effort and cost it would have taken to refill the 5#er.
Thank you
I've done this- used a stock adapter that screwed right into the regulator. Won't work with the original mount, obviously. Couldn't find it in my amazon history...search over on the virtual weber bullet forums and you'll find the part number. Only been using it a few months, though and it seemed like I should have gotten more out of a canister than I did. Wish I had more capacity but it works for now.
http://weberkettleclub.com/forums/weber-kettles-accessories/cheapest-and-easiest-ss-performer-20-lp-conversion-only-$8-99/
Forget the 5lb and the 1lb its more costly and a hassle. Just switch to the 20lb and you life will be a lot easier. The 20# tank fits perfect without any modifications.
http://weberkettleclub.com/forums/weber-kettles-accessories/cheapest-and-easiest-ss-performer-20-lp-conversion-only-$8-99/
For the sake of posterity - I finally got this to work, with the exact two adaptors I mentioned previously. It appears as though I simply wasn't attaching the adaptors tight enough - if they're not tight enough the gas won't flow. A tad embarrassed but very happy to have this working now!
Just glad it was something simple !!!
Quote from: Rjames on July 12, 2015, 06:59:48 PM
For the sake of posterity - I finally got this to work, with the exact two adaptors I mentioned previously. It appears as though I simply wasn't attaching the adaptors tight enough - if they're not tight enough the gas won't flow. A tad embarrassed but very happy to have this working now!
Any chance of getting a pic of the set up?